My Journey From Fear an Interview

These are the show notes and highlights of a Conversation with the Author of the Eggshell Effect – My Journey from Fear” Joel Holc. Click Here to visit Joel’s site and buy the book. Listen to the Episode, Watch the Interview on YouTube, and read how the book impacted me. Immediately below is text segments that are highlights from the interview with Joel which is followed by a complete transcription.

What is My Journey From Fear About

The book is really is about my journey and the actual effect, my journey from fear. Basically, about 12 years ago, I was really sick and I was barely able to walk and I went To the doctors, and eventually, I was diagnosed with autoimmune disease. And the doctor told me to say, Joel, within 10 years, you probably got to be living in a wheelchair, so get your life in order to live in a wheelchair.

And few weeks later, I thought crossed my mind. What about if it’s true, that I really brought this disease on myself? If it’s true that I brought the disease on myself, it’s made for me that I also can heal myself if I have the power to make myself sick. I have the power to make myself healthy and just completely change the rest of my life. Obviously, as you know, the book has many, many layers and many points.

The Early Part of Joel’s Journey – Born in Argentina, grew up in Israel.Ten Pittsburgh via New York City

A day or two later I said okay, you know maybe they something over there actually went on and really at that point it was not without it was just straight to the straight to the conversation what’s the point without all the people around it and clapping and, and the outside noise just really listening to the message. And the message resonates with me I register online and I went to do the form and what opened up from that, really, it just it’s been an extremely important part of my journey.

…every person that showed up into my life, I cannot look back and say, I wish that this and that did not happen. Because then I will not be who I am today. And we are everything that we do and everything that we are, it’s all connected one to another. It’s all change that connects. So we cannot look back and say oh this chain for my payments. suffering, I wish that you did not happen. If this chain was not happening, we will be ending up in a completely different place. Not good or bad, just different.

A Story of Transformation, Spirituality, and Health

Later in my life that after I was diagnosed and then my mom passed away. And in 2013 and I flew, I flew, I flew to Israel. This is where my family lived. I flew to Israel, and I was there with my mom for the last week of her life. And I was there for the week after I was with my family, and I flew back home. And as I came back home The following day, and my wife at the time, say I’m living so Within a week time I lost my mom and I lost my wife that I loved them both dearly. And I want to die. This is the best way for me to describe it. I didn’t want to kill myself, but I would be okay to die. My kids were there that at the time. I know, again, this is two kids that I been a single parent from almost the time that they were born. And they I know that they need me I know that they need to leave for them. But I just it just was so painful. And eventually, I asked myself the question, how did they get here?

A Life Kidnapped by Fear

In that moment, my life got kidnapped by fear. And my life has never been the same from that moment on. I immediately felt stupid. I immediately felt bended, I immediately felt like I have a secret. How would they cover my secret right now that I’m stupid. And the reason that I had to do first grade again is because I have dyslexia so I could not read or write in first Indiana first grade and quite honestly, I could not read or write in the end of the second time that they went to first grade but they say we have to let him go. We can’t keep him in first grade forever. And, and but the at that point He’s really white everything got killed it in my life eventually living in under tremendous amount of shame, secret self talk this is what basically should shape out of who is the people that they chose to surround myself with? Why did I chose them why that happened and then this is was when the lady in the in the forum say you made yourself sick, this is where it came from. And eventually, many years later I was able to heal myself from the autoimmune disease i was able not just working actually was able to run five K and take in 10 k within a month period. It’s it just it just our pages are powerful online is

Building a Team to Support You

I hope that the people that go to read the book will find encouragement for themselves and will be able to learn something from my experience, they’ve got to reflect for their own life. The reason that I shared this is because this is what I did. I and it’s from so much pain and suffering. I need this team Joel, to be able to be able to breed to be able to just take care of myself to be able to just survive the day. You know, I build team draw when you The time that I couldn’t eat, I couldn’t sleep I was sleeping probably two hours, two hours a day if I’m lucky, in 20 minutes, break of sleeping for 20 minutes waking up in my mind starts running. I this was an many times this was the only good thing that I actually had to look forward in the day just to be surrounded by people that and helping. And my therapist was she actually the one that called him drawl.

Tim – “One of the things in the book was people go to read it is while you’re the central character, the people that came into your life, both positively and negatively. I think A lot of readers will identify with whether it’s parental situations, former partners, business and personal. The fear of abandonment. You know, it was interesting to me reading the section about the bodybuilder because I was a power lifter. And it was for different reasons. But I wanted to be the guy that was so big and so strong. Nobody ever came up to him, so I never had to deal with it. Right. So it was really interesting that I could look at that and look at different people that you represented in your life and see other people frankly, from parts of my life to it was fascinating. And I think a lot of people will get that kind of identity from it.”

Returns to Joel Speaking  

You made my day. That is the purpose of the book, The purpose of the book, and I’ve been blessed by many great things in my life, and I’ve been blessed by many obstacles. I’ve been blessed by many gifts, and I didn’t play by many challenges, and I share all of them, and somebody will find something to relate into the book that will speak to themselves and be able to get connected to why they do what they do. And my hope that this book will support people to ask themselves the question, how did they get here and understand that and be able to, I mean, we don’t need to be as broken as I was when I asked this question. We can we can be in a good place. People can be in a good place when they read this book, but how did they get here?

Tomorrow arrived and it was yesterday and I missed it

So I remember when I was a barely walking a single parent my kids were young. And for those of us that live in the northeast, we have basements here and this is where the washer and dryer is and going all the way down to the basement and climbing up barely working. And we the kids with the kids, clean clothes and ice and we all heard about sacrifice today for a better tomorrow. Correct. This is a statement that we all heard about it and and some of us really live by that and I did. I said okay, don’t worry about it just just tomorrow will be better tomorrow will be better. And as I walking up the stairs, it taught cross my mind. sacrificed today for a better tomorrow. And I didn’t realize that tomorrow was here already yesterday and I mess it all up. Now I’m getting fields just saying this right now and they wish that at that moment my life will be transformed unfortunately it took probably another 10 or some years after that for my life to completely be transformed but the stuff that just was planning in my subconscious mind eventually we’re blowing that way. There is there is a there is a difference between sacrificing today for better tomorrow than we can be committed we can be a engage we can be but that the sacrifice sacrifice of today for a better tomorrow it’s almost pointless because we don’t enjoy the journey not enjoyed the journey today could be life difficult today could you could you could put a lot of effort into work or into into schooling or into into building something that is really important that you don’t see the results yet. I’ve been working on this book for five years. Never For a second, I felt that I’m sacrificing any moments to build this book. It was always a journey, it was always a joy. Sometimes it did not feel 100% and did not went exactly the way that they want to. But it was always a creation. It was not a sacrifice.

 

Not reacting from a place of fear, but reacting from a place of love

So just to be clear, in my theory, and in my book, and in my experience of my life, we live life and it’s not only I mean, this is Also my experience of working with and with people that I worked throughout the years is that when we are sourcing ourselves from fear we are in a reaction nobody actually do anything from fear with the clear talk because the fear energy in the back of our mind in our subconscious mind just keep burning and burning and burning for me.

Now, unfortunately my experience in my talk is that most people in the world living are like that. This is why we have so many words between people, we this is why we are so arguing. And this is like people fight and this is why just just there it’s not just, we’re always there to protect something.

If we’re choosing life, from love, and energy, and I just want to be clear, this is not the intimate, romantic love that I’m talking about. This is not a lot between a man or a woman or men and a man or a woman like this is not what I’m talking about. And this is not anything to do with sexuality or anything like that. This is energy of love.

My JOURNEY From Fear -Perspective: when you’re hammer

Note: this is prompted by Tim sharing that he sees his value as a builder of things, and will break them just to fix them. He “knows he’s a hammer and everything is a nail”.

Return to Joel Speaking

When you’re a hammer that this is the glasses that we wear. This is the only way for us to see life. Yep. Because your hammer. So you see everything is a nail whether it is or not. And if it’s not a nail you make it a no and then then people don’t think people then things don’t work because not everybody or No. And we can I mean, we’re not going to do it right now. But if you’re looking at your own life, and the book will give you an opportunity to do that. Why is it you think you’re a hammer?

Because that’s where you perceived your value. The truth of the matter is, this is all in your head. Yep. This is all something that happened to you in your childhood that reshaped your life.

And you stepped back. That’s a great segue. Actually, something we all have that something. Right. And it took you I’ll say, a dozen people roughly until somebody really asked that question that took you back to that moment.

Lessons From Our Lives 

As we talked about earlier, is what occurred to us as a bad thing. As a painful thing. It’s an opportunity. So I lost my father 12 years ago, few years later, I ended up my first marriage. So in a sense, you can say, Hey, Joe, you had the experience of losing a parent and experience of getting divorced for the first time. And I did not. It did not awaken me.In our life, we getting the same lesson again and again and again. And whatever your relationship to God’s to the universe, whatever it is, is, I will call it God. God will basically turn up the volume a little bit and say, “Hey, I give you a little bit less and you did not get it. Let me give you another lesson.” 

Joel’s Work to Help Others Live Life From a Place of Love

So today I speak about the book you know to different organizations and to the eye and it’s not it’s much about the book as much about it. I’m more focusing on the on the fear energy, how the fear energy sourcing us and how fear energy causing us to do what we do. And so this is one thing that they do and I also doing a personnel coaching with people. And because this story of, of my story is so related to so many people and for example with you, you know, we met we did not talk about what you were saying about fixing it, you brought it up in the middle of the interview. And this this could be Probably two to three hours worth of work for us to do together to get complete with that. So this is what they do when I work with people I just support them in, in their life journey and some of them chart showing up because life don’t work because relationship don’t work, work or business does not work at Simon spam shop. Because for health reasons, I’m not. I don’t give any health advices I just support people to look at their own life to understand why they got sick in the first place.

And so this is the work the work that they do.

Helping Others on Their Own Journey

We do a lot of meditation together. We do Reiki together, and and people just just share their their their life and by me sharing Are things that they experience opening up for them? that opportunity to look at themselves. One of the things that they say in the book, their willingness to be vulnerable is the access to freedom.

Want more things like My Journey From Fear?

Full My Journey from Fear Episode Transcript.

Tim Kubiak 0:00
Have you ever looked around and wondered why you are where you are in life and the events that led to that? Exactly what happened that got you to this point. Today we’re going to talk to the author Joe Hulk of the eggshell effect and his journey from living from fear to love, and those recognitions in his own life and work. Thanks for listening to both types of business. I’m your host, Tim Kubiak. If you haven’t already done so please subscribe if you like what you hear. today. I’d like to welcome Joel

Joel Holc 0:33
to the show.

Tim Kubiak 0:34
Joel is an energy awareness. Also a lifetime entrepreneur is an emerging author in the healing arts. His book, which we’re going to be talking about, as he takes show, it’s his story, how he discovered the source of his lifetime illness, and how he powerfully transformed his health beyond the limitations that traditional medicine had sent for him. The book talks about his own journey, his work with his client, and he creates a space for others to become self aware in a way that enables them to tap into their energy as a source, a source that empowers them to choose freely throughout their life’s journey. Joel discovered this approach to self healing while battling severe autoimmune disease, one that conventional medical practitioners had diagnosed him with as a lifetime in a wheelchair. His transformation is based around the altering of his lifestyle, which includes a plant based diet, spiritual awareness, and a connection and emotional growth. This is leaps and bounds from his health as a boy. He was born in Argentina in 1967, the son of a Holocaust survivor, and he and his family emigrated to Israel when he was three years old, growing up on a kibbutz. In his 20s, he traveled the world of South America in Europe. And then New York, finally settling in my hometown of Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. He has two grown children, and they’re starting on their own journeys. He’s a longtime entrepreneur. As I said, He’s worked in real estate and in home sales. He owns a marketing network farm, but his critical focus is providing energy awareness to others. This is a really insightful conversation. His story alone is amazing, inspiring. reading his book is one of the few things that has truly touched me as a reader and caused me to look at things in my own life. So I’ve enjoyed this conversation, and I go places that typically guarded old Tim doesn’t go in this conversation with Joe, I hope you enjoy it. So I’m joined by Joe Hoke, the author of the eggshell effect. And today’s conversation, we’re going to talk about living a life from a place of love rather than fear. Quite a bit about Joel’s story. And frankly, some of the things I think I took away from the book, and he could tell me if I’m wrong, so thanks for being here.

Joel Holc 2:49
Good morning. Thank you very much, Tim, how are you today?

Tim Kubiak 2:52
I am fantastic yourself. I am Great. Thank you. So I know the books pre production now. But by the time this comes out, it should be released. So tell everybody where they can find your book.

Joel Holc 3:05
So as of right now, I mean, eventually it will be an Amazon. But as of right now, for any pre order, or anybody that will order directly the book from a actual effect, or johaug, that can actually affect that time, they will receive a signed copy. So if they want to do that, I’d be happy to sign it. And and then after that, probably by the time that the protests will be out, it will be on Amazon as well. Okay.

Tim Kubiak 3:34
Joel, tell us what you should tell us what the book is about because there’s so many different ways to tell a story. And you weave your personal journey and some really, almost intimate details of how you got to where you are from where you begin into this.

Joel Holc 3:50
How much time do we have Tim? We have an hour.

Tim Kubiak 3:53
We have an hour. If we go longer, I’ll cut it into two episodes. No worries.

Joel Holc 3:58
Okay. So so so the book is really is about my journey, and the actual effect and my journey from fear. And basically, about 12 years ago, I was really sick. And I was barely able to walk. And I went to the doctors and eventually I was diagnosed with autoimmune disease. And the doctor told me say, Joel, within 10 years, you’re probably going to be living in a wheelchair, so get your life in order to live in a wheelchair. And for about a year or so I actually believe in him. I actually I thought this is the future that I’m living into. And this is this was my future. Now at a time I was a single parent with two young kids and the first thought that crossed my mind is okay within 10 years, both of my kids will be out of high school. And I unfortunately for them, they will have to take care of themselves, but they will be young adults to do that. So it wasn’t. But this was one of the things that crossed my mind, obviously, there were a lot of things but

and for that time

it was going back and forth, I can beat this disease, I cannot, I can, I cannot. And then at that point, I went to actually to a self awareness seminar, and it’s called the form. And in the in the form, the way that it’s the event run is basically everybody sitting in the big room. And there’s a speaker sitting on standing on the top of the stage and running the show, and then their microphones all around the room for people to get up into, and to share their chairs to ask questions and to cook. So I got asked to ask a question. And at the time, I was walking with a cane, barely walking, and I was walking with a cane and the lady that ran the show asked him, what’s wrong with you drove and I say, I have an I have an MS. And she looked at me and she say, you know, it’s an autoimmune disease? I say, Yes, they do. And she said, you know, you brought it on yourself. Now, this was like, hit me in the corner. If you would be in the seminar, this lady took no prisoners like, she, if you battle with this woman, you’re out, there’s no way for you to win. And I had seen a doing that on site, I had no clue what she’s talking about. However, I had no tools to bother her either. So I say okay, for me to be safe, I say, Sure. I know. But it wouldn’t matter. I had no clue what she’s talking about. And the seminar was amazing, I got a lot of value out of it.

And few weeks later, I thought crossed my mind.

And I say, what about if it’s true, that I really brought this disease on myself, if it’s true that they buy the disease on myself, it’s meaning for me that I actually also can heal myself, if I have the power to make myself healthy, as sick, I have the power to make myself healthy.

And this thought,

just completely change the rest of my life. This is a little carried about by the book, obviously, as you know, the book has many, many layers and many points. So I will just give the call back to you if you want to be more specific if you have any questions. Sure.

Tim Kubiak 7:40
So part of the thing in the book, right? Is your background and your personal history before you got to that point. Right? You’d been born in Argentina, is that correct? Great. You grew up in Israel. Correct. And you move to the US kind of on a whim, basically, to attend a wedding outside of New York City got a job and stay. So can you get to fill in a little bit of the blank there for people because it really is a fascinating journey.

Joel Holc 8:13
So so I was born in Argentina. And when I was three years old, my family moved to Israel. And I grew up in Israel until after I finished high school, I finished the service in Israel. And after that, I went to Europe and my passion at the time was horses. I was training horses, and I went to Europe and and I train horses. And it was I thought, this is it I I arrived in heaven and everything will be great. And I turn my passion into into my work. And unfortunately, I lost the passion. And it just became work. And I literally got burnt out. I was working from six o’clock in the morning until 12 o’clock at night, seven days a week. And it was so much a and then I travel a little bit in Europe, then I actually ended up traveling and in South America, I went back to Argentina for the first time as an adult. And I was really on my way back, back home and and my mom called me she say hey, you know, and your cousin is getting married in New York and I planning to be there. Maybe we should meet in New York. And then we can fly back home after that. And I say great, why not? And I have no place to be and then like might as well be in New York for a little bit for I’m going back home. And I slipped in New York and I got a few weeks earlier in New York, and I stay with my family over there my aunt and uncle and they, you know they were very, very kind to me. And I say hey, I have I think I had about four weeks before my mom was arriving and I say let me look for a job and you know, they leave Every culture in the world is in New York, you know, so obviously, there’s plenty of Israelis in New York and they find a job. And by my time that my mind came, I started making money. And so you know, maybe I should stay here a little longer, and then go back to Israel with some money in my pocket, and then start something, but

I never went back,

Tim Kubiak 10:20
You never left,

Joel Holc 10:21
never left.

Tim Kubiak 10:25
So that’s kind of your personal journey. But in the book, you talk about your relationships, from your parents, through your spouse’s, you talk about relationships with business partners, you know, how did that affect ultimately, what led you to that point of going to the forum.

Joel Holc 10:47
So I, I really went to the forum. And I was introduced to the forum by somebody that was, at the time a very good friend of mine. And I was, I was the form itself, actually, when I went to the forum for the first time, and to be introduced to the form, I thought, these people are crazy. I mean, not like, they, I look at them, and I say, these people are crazy. I have, I don’t want to do anything with them. And and then a day or two later, I say, okay, you know, maybe they something maybe they something over there actually went online. And really, at that point, it was not without the it was just straight to the straight to the conversation, what’s the point without all the people around it and clapping and, and the outside noise, just really listening to the message. And the message resonates with me, I register online. And, and I went to do the forum. And what open up from that, really, it just it’s been an extremely important part of my journey. That being underlined like from everything else is important every person to chalk in my life, every person that that brought joy and love and any person that was a pain and sadness and hurt. Every person that showed up in my life supports me to become who I am today. And as you read in the book, you know, you see it, you see a lot of people that brought joy and brought love into my life. And you see a lot of people that brought pain. And people often asked me, Joel, would you remove that with you know, are you mad at this person. And it’s not that I was not mad. I don’t want to you know, at the time, I was mad. But as I grew and as I kept evolving, I understand today. That’s for me to be who I am today. I had to experience everything that I experienced in my life, I had to experience every person that showed up into my life, I cannot look back and say, I wish that piece and that did not happen. Because then I will not be who I am today. And we are everything that we do. And everything that we are, it’s all connected one to another. It’s all change, they’re connected. So we cannot look back and say, Oh, this chain for me pain and suffering. I wish that did not happen. If this chain was not happening, we will be ending up in a completely different place. Not good or bad. Just different. Yeah. But But I will just before you’re asking the next the next question is, the point is, is to be in peace and self love to where we are today. Because if we getting there to be complete, and it does not mean that life is perfect, my life is not perfect, but I am in peace with where I am today. And I understand that for me to be in peace with where I am today. It’s thanks to everything that happened in my life, including the pain and suffering sometimes it’s thanks to the pain and suffering because usually, we are only growing from a pain and suffering. When everything is great. We don’t ask ourselves questions. How do we get here? We don’t ask ourselves question. There is anything more out of life because everything is great and we just floating, but when actually we suffering when we have pain when things don’t go our way. This is when we grow the most.

Tim Kubiak 14:34
So you own that transformation, if you will. You went from essentially being diagnosed with an autoimmune disease and Western medicine. And at the risk of overstating it, you went through a change not just physically, but how you approached your illness, the type of treatments you sought and spiritually Is that fair? Yeah. And, and you talk about the chain link, right? Literally, you make the point at all, later in the book that had you not met one person, you would have never met the other, and ultimately led to you running five K, and then a 10. k. Having been walking with a cane a number of years prior, how did each of those experiences build on top of each other for you.

Joel Holc 15:28
So to understand the chain,

and is

I got to a point, leather leather in the book, and leather in my life that after I was diagnosed, and then my mom passed away. And in 2013, and I flew, I flew, I flew to Israel, this is where my family live. I flew to Israel, and I was there with my mom for the last week of her life. And I was there for the week after I was with my family. And I flew back home. And as I came back home The following day, and my wife at the time, say, I’m I’m living. So within a week time I lost my mom, and I lost my wife that I love them both dearly. And I want to die. This is the best way for me to describe it. I didn’t want to kill myself, but I would be okay to die. My kids were there that at the time. I know, again, this is two kids that I been a single parent from almost the time that they were born. And they I knew that they need me I know that they need to leave for them. But I just it just was so painful. And eventually I asked myself the question, how did they get here? Now, if we remember the question that the lady in the landmark forum asked me if you brought it on yourself. Now, as I start healing myself, I was very, it was fairly easy for me to do the things too. I stopped, I stopped drinking coffee, I stopped drinking alcohol, I stopped drinking anything that I had to drink. I was just drinking water. And I’m still today, Willie, it’s 99% of what drinking is, is water. I stopped eating gluten I started stop eating meat I became eventually became a vegan, gluten free and taking supplements so that they’re doing things where it’s fairly easy for me to do that gave me a tremendous amount of support in my healing. that eventually, within probably six months, I was able to let the conventional doctor go and just working with alternative doctors and being off medications. But this is still did not went to the core statement. And the question is you got yourself sick, just because I was able to heal myself. It did not give me the answer. Now as I came back home, from Israel after my mom passed away, and then my wife at the time left. And within probably few weeks I asked myself the question is how did they get here? How did they end up here? Having being a single parent for two kids running multiple businesses that really don’t enjoy any of them living in a city in a country that I never had the desire to live in. And having two marriages falling apart, having a disease like how did they get here like what happened. And for that, they start looking back at the chains that we all connected and went back to the last day of first grade as sitting in the classroom, and the teacher saying giving all the kids their report cards into diploma for first grade. And in the diploma let’s say the name of the school the name of the student completing first grade, and welcome to go to second grade. In my diploma there was my the name of the school my name and where it say welcome to go to second grade there was a black marker. But no, no, you’re not going to second grade you have to do first grade again.

And in that moment,

Unknown Speaker 19:40
my life got kidnapped by fear. And my life has never been the same from that moment on. I immediately felt stupid. I immediately felt bended. I immediately felt like I have a secret. How would they cover my secret right now that I’m stupid and the reason that they Head to do first grade again is because I have dyslexia so I could not read or write in first Indiana first grade. And quite honestly, I could not read or write in the end of the second time that they went to first grade but they say we have to let him go We can’t keep him for first grade forever. And, and but the at that point is really why everything got killed it in my life. And eventually living in under tremendous amount of shame, secret

Joel Holc 20:34
self talk.

This is what basically should shape out of who is the people that they chose to surround myself with? Why did I chose them? why that happened. And then this is was when the lady in the in the forum say you made yourself sick, this is where it came from. And eventually, many years later, I was able to heal myself from the autoimmune disease, I was able not just working actually was able to run five K and take and 10 k within a month period. It’s it just it just our pages are powerful online is

Tim Kubiak 21:17
you took that transformation. And there’s a line in the book about you built team Joel. And to me that spoke about the power of community and surrounding yourself with the right people. Is that really what you’re trying to encourage the readers to do at that point and in those reflections.

Joel Holc 21:41
So

I hope that the people that go to read the book will find encouragement for themselves, and we’ll be able to learn something from my experience that go to reflect for their own life. The reason that I shared this is because this is what I did. I and it’s from so much pain and suffering, I need this team job to be able to be able to breed to be able to just take care of myself to be able to just survive the day. You know, I build a team Joel, when in the time that I couldn’t eat, I couldn’t sleep I would I was sleeping probably two hours, two hours a day, if I’m lucky. In 20 minutes, break of sleeping for 20 minutes waking up and my mind starts running. I This was and many times this was the only good thing that I actually had to look forward in the day just to be surrounded by people that and helping. And my therapist was she actually the one that called him drawl. And this is I adapt that. And she’s a very part big part of Team draw. And that supports me to do it. And it’s true is that who we surrounding ourselves with, will impact who we become. And if we surrounding ourselves and this is going to apply to anything in life, it’s going to apply into, into our own health into our own well being into our own relationship into our own business into our own work, wherever we do is who we surrounding ourselves, Fred is really there to to support us. And, and the beauty is it’s there. It’s an exchange. It’s real team is an exchange. It’s not we call it team draw, because I was the one that connect everybody together, but it wasn’t extreme. It was give and take it’s not you know, it’s it’s not that I was the one that just taking, taking taking without giving anything back. So some people it was I actually hire their services, and I actually get the money for some people it was they did not get paid, but they got value outside of this. And even the people that got paid. They received something in exchange more than just just money.

Tim Kubiak 24:08
So one of the things on the court was people go to read it is while you’re the central character, the people that came into your life, both positively and negatively. I think a lot of readers will identify with whether it’s parental situations, former partners, business and personal, the fear of abandonment. You know, it was interesting to me reading the section about the bodybuilder because I was a power lifter, and it was for different reasons. But I wanted to be the guy that was so big and so strong. Nobody ever came up to him, so I never had to deal with it. Right. So it was really interesting that I can look at that and look at different people that you represented in your life and see other people frankly from parts of my life to it was fascinating. And I think a lot of people will get that Kind of identity from it.

Joel Holc 25:03
You made my day.

Well, good, okay. And this, this is the purpose of the book, The purpose of the book, and I’ve been blessed by many great things in my life. And I’ve been blessed by many obstacles. I’ve been blessed by many gifts, and I’ve been blessed by many challenges. And I share all of them. And somebody will find something to relate into the book that will speak to themselves and be able to get connected to why they do what they do. And my hope that this book will support people to ask themselves the question, how did they get here and understand that and be able to, I mean, we don’t need to be as broken as I was, when I asked this question. We can we can be in a good place. People can be in a good place when they read this book. But how did they get here? And like you say, isn’t about the bodybuilder in the book? You can relate to that. And you can understand why he did what he did not this gentleman. His life story led him to where it is. And it’s not exactly how it’s led to you. However, the source of why you did what you did and the source of why he did what he did. It’s probably a thing.

Tim Kubiak 26:21
Yeah,

Joel Holc 26:22
Correct?

Tim Kubiak 26:22
Yeah, if you look, I was small when I was a child and bullied by older kids. So I wanted to be bigger and extract revenge, that that’s the truth. So yeah,

Joel Holc 26:33
yeah. And this is why this book called my journey from fear. And this is your journey from fear of you want to become strong. Not necessarily because you want to become strong. You were afraid to be bully, you were afraid to get feedback. You were afraid. And this is how we live in life. Most of the things that we’re doing in life are reaction to fear. Yep.

Tim Kubiak 26:56
Yep. And it in that case, when you asked him about the first time he walked into the gym, first time I walked into commercial gym was in Bridgeville, Pa. Right. And I could remember that day like that, when I read that piece. Yeah. So yeah,

You

have an interesting blend, in the book. And by the way, I love it, because it is very open, you’re very accepting when presented with people situations, or dilemmas that might conventional challenge, conventional morality, there’s two or three cases in the book of that, but you also blend different types of spirituality in the book, along with, you know, you talked about your therapist, you know, some traditional Western medicine type approaches as well. And it’s part of it is you found a way to make all those different variables work. We talked about team Joel, but were you actively seeking out new parts new solutions? Or did they happen naturally for you?

Joel Holc 28:04
They act unnaturally. Yeah. And any to adjust even in the book, just one door led to another door and one opening led to another opening and one person led to another person. And, and

the beauty of that

Unknown Speaker 28:23
is that these people were there throughout all my life. I never got connected to them. Because I was so focus as a licensed destination. And never accept life as a journey I was it was always a place to get always a place to be always a mic to accomplish. So so when I live my life with So focus on getting somewhere I did not really enjoy life. Because I thought I will be happy over there. Once I get there, I will be happy. And I could not see the people that work through my life hack because I didn’t I was like the horse in the race that I couldn’t see them. Once I let the blind sides go. And once they started relating to life as a journey, I could slow down and actually absorb the energy of these people. Get these people into my life and then just see more people and more people coming simulscan came and brought very little value. And some of them brought came in and brought tremendous amount of value. And it was okay in lifeless destination. If I meet somebody that bring me no value, I’ve just wasted an hour or a day or a week or months of my life because you brought me no service but sometimes these people just just it’s we did not meet in the right time. Yeah. And we’d still we were supposed to meet.

Tim Kubiak 30:04
I think the phrase you used in the book was tomorrow arrived. And it was yesterday. And I missed it. Is that right? or close to right.

Unknown Speaker 30:13
So thank you for mentioning that. And so I remember when I was a barely walking a single parent, my kids were young. And for those of us that live in the northeast, we have basements here and this is where the washer and dryer is and going all the way down to the basement and climbing up, barely, barely working. And we the kids with the kids clean clothes. And I and we all heard about sacrifice today for a better tomorrow. Correct. This is a statement that we all heard about it and and some of us really live by that and I did. I said okay, don’t worry about it. Just Just tomorrow will be better, tomorrow will be better. And as I walking up the stairs, I taught cross my mind. sacrified today for a better tomorrow. And I didn’t realize that tomorrow I was here already yesterday, and I miss it all up. Now, I’m getting chills just saying this right now. And I wish that at that moment, my life will be transformed. Unfortunately, it took probably another 10 some years after that for my life to completely be transformed. But the stuff that just are planning in my subconscious mind

Joel Holc 31:40
eventually we’re blowing

that we do is there is a there is a difference between sacrificing today for a better tomorrow they can be committed we can be a in engage we can be but the secretary sacrifices today for a better tomorrow. It’s almost pointless. Because we don’t enjoy the journey. not enjoying the journey today could be life difficult today could you could you could put a lot of effort into work or into into schooling or into into building something that is really important that you don’t see the result yet. I’ve been working on this book for five years. Never for a second, I felt that I’m sacrificing any moments to build this book. It was always a journey, it was always a joy. Sometimes it did not feel 100% and did not went exactly the way that they want to. But it was always a creation. It was not a sacrifice.

Tim Kubiak 32:41
One of the key messages, you repeat it. And I like that you call it in the opening, you say some things will repeat here. But that’s quite intentional. And they repeat and they repeat and are built upon as you read through. And one of the things is not reacting from a place of fear, but reacting from a place of love. How did that transform your life.

Joel Holc 33:08
So

Unknown Speaker 33:11
just to be clear, in my theory, and in my book, and in my experience of my life, we live life. And it’s not only I mean, this is also my experience of working with and with people that I worked throughout the years is that when we are sourcing ourselves from fear, we are in a reaction. Nobody actually do anything from fear with the clear talk. Because the fear energy in the back of our mind, in our subconscious mind just keep burning and burning and burning. For me. It was keeping a secret that they can’t read and write and keep it in a secret that I’m stupid. So everything that I would see would come from that place to cover up the secret. I didn’t want to be known as stupid. And more than that if people would come to me and say Joe, you’re pretty smart. In what I would hear is I school YouTube hmm I would not take it as a compliment. I will hear I full YouTube because I could not absorb that. Now this is where we are we action from fear. Now, unfortunately my experience in my talk is that most people in the world living like that. This is why we have so many words between people. We This is why we are so arguing and this is why people fight and this is why just there it’s not just we’re always there to protect Samsung.

Joel Holc 34:53
Now

if we choosing life, from love, energy and I just Want To be clear, this is not the intimate, romantic love that I’m talking about. This is not a lot between a man or a woman or a man and a man or a woman, like this is not what I’m talking about. And this is not anything to do with sexuality or anything like that this is energy of love. When we are sourcing ourselves from energy of love, we can actually freely choose what we want to do next. It’s easier said than done. The biggest challenge is to acknowledge the fact that we are operating in a reaction from fear, and where is it coming from? Because until we don’t understand and getting complete with the energy of where it’s coming from, it was always going to be there. The conversation of me being stupid or smart, or being able to read or not able to read this conversation is being complete the energy of this incomplete. But it’s still showing up every now and then. And the knowledge and abilities to actually recognize right now it’s right here right now. And what do I do with that? Because if we don’t recognize that we, this is actually sourcing us, we cannot do anything. If we don’t understand that we’ve been a reaction from fear right here right now. Obviously, we have no choices, because we are in the reaction from fear.

Tim Kubiak 36:27
Yeah, I use the phrase, you know, when everything’s when your hammer everything looks like a nail. Right. And I and I’ve been the hammer much of my professional life. So I know.

Joel Holc 36:41
Because this is the glasses that we wear. Yeah. This is the only way for us to see life. Yep. Because your hammer.

Tim Kubiak 36:52
Yep. Yeah. So you see everything is nail whether it is or not.

Joel Holc 36:56
And if it’s not a nail, you make it a note and then then people don’t take people then things don’t work. Because not everybody or No.

Tim Kubiak 37:03
Yeah, no, that’s, that’s exactly right. I’m the rough. I know, I learned the hard way that I’m the wrong guy to put in front of something that is working. You give me something broken on the Happy, happy, man, because I’ll build it and fix it business wise, you give me something that’s working out, break it so I can fix it.

Joel Holc 37:22
And we can I mean, we’re not going to do it right now. But if you’re looking at your own life, and the book will give you an opportunity to do that. Yep. is why is it? Yeah, yeah. Yeah.

Tim Kubiak 37:34
Yeah. Because that’s where I perceived my value. Right. Yeah, absolutely.

Joel Holc 37:40
Yeah. Because if things not broken, then you not valuable, right. But the truth of the matter? is, this is all in your head. Yep. This is all something that happened to you in your childhood that that reshape your life.

Tim Kubiak 37:55
Yeah. Yeah. And you step back. That’s a great segue, actually, something we all have that something. Right. And it took you, I’ll say, a dozen people roughly, until somebody really asked that question that took you back to that moment. Yeah. So I’m

Joel Holc 38:17
on that. It’s the people. And the experience. And again, as we talked about earlier, is what we occur to us as a bad thing as a painful thing. It’s an opportunity.

So I lost my father.

Unknown Speaker 38:35
12 years ago, a few years later, I ended up my first marriage. So in a sense, you can say, Hey, Joe, you had the experience of losing a parent and experience of getting divorce for the first time? And I did not.

Joel Holc 38:53
It did not to wait for me.

Yeah, so in our life, we getting a same lesson again and again and again. And whatever your relationship to God’s to the universe, whatever it is, I will call it God, God will basically turn up the volume a little bit, say, Hey, I give you a little bit less than you did not get it. But we gave you another lesson like we get it. And eventually, he had to do if my mom would pass away because my mom would pass away. My second wife would leave because our relationship had to end because it just head to end. This is what was in my journey. Now if, if it would be in two years apart, I would not be feeling the pain that they felt because it was in one week part and the fact that it was so painful, and in such a high volume of pain. This is what made me to be become so broken that I had to put the pieces together. So when we’re looking back, this is where the pain starts. As your point is, you need to fix things. You need to be valuable for all of us. Sometimes we actually open up and look, hey, why do you need to do that. And some of us would look at that, because all the other doors are shot. And we need to open the door that we’ve been trying to avoid all our life to open. And every, all the doors needs to be shot, faster, open the door that we really don’t want to work through. And we could, yeah.

Tim Kubiak 40:32
So talk about the work you’re doing now.

Joel Holc 40:35
So today, a,

Unknown Speaker 40:38
I speak about the book, you know, to different organizations. And to the end, it’s not as much about the book as much about that. I’m more focusing on bit on the fear energy, how the fear energy sourcing us, and how fear energy causing us to do what we do. And so this is why I’m saying that they do. And I also doing a personnel coaching with people. And because this story of, of my story is so related to so many people, and for example, with you, you know, we met, we did not talk about what you were saying about fixing your brother up in the middle of the interview. And this, this could be probably two to three hours worth of work for us to do together to get complete with that. So this is what they do when I work with people I just support them in, in their life journey. And some of them chart showing up because life don’t work because relationships don’t work. Work, or business does not work. In San Jose, I’m sure. Because for health reasons, I’m not. I don’t give any health advices I just support people to look at their own life to understand why they got sick in the first place.

Joel Holc 42:00
And so this is the work the work that they do.

Tim Kubiak 42:03
And part of you take them on their own journey. Is that fair?

Unknown Speaker 42:08
Yeah. So we do a lot of meditation together. We do Reiki together, and and people just just share their, their their life and by me sharing similar things that they experience, opening up for them. that opportunity to look at themselves. One of the things that they say in the book, their willingness to be vulnerable is the access to freedom.

Joel Holc 42:35
Now,

I could sit here and say, okay, Tim, be vulnerable. It’s not going to work. Yeah, now you share about yourself because I share about myself, right? And you can look at yourselves because you feel safe and comfortable. Because you sitting in front of somebody that is willing to be vulnerable. Because being vulnerable in our societies, a carer is a weakness.

Tim Kubiak 43:05
Yeah, don’t show it. You’re taught from the time you’re little. Yeah.

Joel Holc 43:09
Don’t show it. Yep.

minute. Yep. Man, don’t cry. What are you afraid of? Yep. It’s not like this is this is what we’ve been programmed from. From the first moment of us growing. I think people that can show from the ability is people that are comfortable in their own skin. You have nothing to hide, I can disappoint people will judge me, they will judge my accent will judge the way that I speak will judge the way that they can read cannot read. And I got it. I can’t not everybody go to lightning, not everybody go to find value in the book. And I’m okay with that. And if one person get value out of this book, I did my job.

Tim Kubiak 43:55
Yeah, I’m sure many more than one will.

Joel Holc 43:57
But I’m only concerned about the one that got the value right here right now. And then these are not the person. And then these are not the person. And I think and I hope and think that more than one person will find value in this book. But if the person did every person that getting value out of this book, and their life will be open to different possibilities, thanks to the fact that they were willing to read the book and really observe the book and really do the work. Because this is not a reading book. This is a working book.

Tim Kubiak 44:28
Yeah, bringing a book, set some time aside, in it is literally a a story almost in a parallel sense. And then an invitation to reflect at the end of each section. Right. And then it ends with a series of reflections and devotions kind of in, you know, so you can read it straight through, but the real value is when you stop and start to do even if it’s just a little bit of the work you recommended. You know you really really makes us Stop and think like I told you yesterday when we connected.

Yeah.

Joel Holc 45:04
And this is this is

why eventually the book was created like that. And some people will read it straight through and come back to it. Some people will read a chapter at a time, some people will not read it, some people who buy it and never, never open it, some people will never buy it. And it’s okay. And I just hope and looking forward for the people that it will impact your life.

Tim Kubiak 45:32
Do you mind sharing kind of as a closing point, the story behind the egg shell

Joel Holc 45:37
of the name? Yeah?

Tim Kubiak 45:39
Yeah.

Joel Holc 45:41
So

as I as I as I share a to it to these interview, and the part of when my mom passed away, and when I went back to come back to Pittsburgh, and I did that day time as they say, I couldn’t eat I couldn’t sleep I could I was I was praying for somebody. At a time I was really praying for my wife at the time to come back just just I like to do everything and I and I thought in the moment that she’s coming back my life will be okay, I will forgive her I will do did just come back and I did everything that they could do get it ever come back and she didn’t. And I was hoping for something outside of me to fix me. I was praying for somebody to touch my shoulder and say, You fix you heal, everything is okay. Then I remember, in one point of time, when I was 10 years old, beckon Israel, I grew up in a kibbutz this is a this is a is a farm living environment. We, as kids, we start working from, ah, z, where I like working is we always work. And as kids we ran,

and we had like a petting zoo that we that we ran.

Unknown Speaker 47:09
And this particular day, I happen to work in depending Zoo and cleaning up the shade, where the shade over there, there were some animals in there small animals, and, and most of the animals were outside free and big cages and and now all this place was running by kids. I mean, we managed everything. And we took care of the animals we did, we kept the place clean, we did everything. No, we had one adult that was there to make sure that we don’t hurt ourselves. And we don’t care if the animals but besides like all the labor and everything was done by the kids. And this particular day I was working and cleaning up the shed that we had there. And in the shed, we had an incubator for eggs that their moms abandoned them. And there was big, big light and heating lamps to make sure that they actually hatch. And this particular day, and

Joel Holc 48:09
I was looking at the incubator, and I see

a chick trying to break through the eggshell. And I was fascinated. And it was like, it’s an amazing and I’m looking looking and I see that the chick breaking the eggshell, and then stop breaking the egg trail and then stop. And I reach with my arm. And I want to help the chase to break the eggshell. Because I see him struggling, not Luckily, the gentleman, the adult gentleman that was actually supervising us, I didn’t even see him there. Like luckily he was standing next to me. And as soon as he saw me reaching with my arm, he grabbed my arm and say, don’t do that. And I looked at him and I say why not. And you say the cheek needs to build his muscles inside the extra by breaking the extra to be able to live outside of the actual. And at the time, I mean, I was 10 years old. I don’t know if this is the words that you actually use, but this is what I understood from that. And, and I put it in my memory bank and moved on obviously I let the chick do the chicken I know. And this was a insignificant day for me and these gentlemen, extremely significant day for the chick. But I did not know that this day will actually will be so important in my life. Fast forwarding again, being 45 years old, and it’s my life as long as I know it’s falling apart. I all of a sudden remember this day with a chick and say that I am Looking I am I am the chick inside the extra right now. And all the pain and suffering that I feel is to build the muscles to live outside of this actual that I build around myself this now this actual I build around myself throughout my life is to be safe is to be protected to hide my secrets to hide my weaknesses. I felt safe inside this actual but this actual also was limiting me. And now it was my time either to break that extra or to shrink and to leave safe inside the Expo. And from that moment on, I shift any obstacle that show up in my life is an opportunity to break the eggshell and to build the muscles have to survive outside the expo or back I will use not surviving I will use to live really outside direction. And my invitation for people that will read it is to shift their relationship to what a character is as a problem to what the character has as a challenge to shift it to an opportunity to see what is available on daddy’s side of this pain, what is available on the other side of the struggle what is available outside of the eggshell that we build ourselves around itself this lever to keep ourselves safe.

Tim Kubiak 51:26
Joel, thank you so much for being here. Thank you for sharing your story. Links to Joel’s website to the book itself and what not are all in the show notes are also going to be featured on TimKubiak.com. So thank you again. Thank you. I appreciate you